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Acorn Arcade forums: News and features: VPod Unveiled at Wakefield Show
 

Wakefield Show 2009

Posted by Andrew Duffell on 08:01, 25/4/2009 | , , , , , ,
 
Wakefield RISC OS ShowThe 2009 Wakefield Show takes place today.
  • Stuart Tyrrell Developments' have unveiled their VPod graphics accelerator. For £149, the podule card for the Risc PC range of computers features hardware acceleration and high resolutions such as 1680x1050 in 16 million colours.
  • NetSurf 2.0 has been released and is available for download on the NetSurf website.
  • RISC OS Open has been demonstrated running on a A7000 computer.
Link: Wakefield Show news (via Twitter)

 
  VPod Unveiled at Wakefield Show
  ad (11:59 25/4/2009)
  Steve (12:28 25/4/2009)
    bhtooefr (23:59 25/4/2009)
  sa110_mk (06:46 26/4/2009)
  nunfetishist (09:18 26/4/2009)
    ad (09:48 26/4/2009)
      SimonC (10:20 26/4/2009)
        Phlamethrower (12:19 26/4/2009)
        highlandcattle (13:19 26/4/2009)
          sa110_mk (14:49 26/4/2009)
            VincceH (16:09 26/4/2009)
              vanpeebles (07:37 27/4/2009)
                SimonC (10:30 27/4/2009)
      nunfetishist (15:52 27/4/2009)
        VincceH (17:31 27/4/2009)
          mr-mac (19:02 27/4/2009)
            sa110_mk (12:21 28/4/2009)
              mr-mac (12:31 28/4/2009)
                bhtooefr (15:13 30/4/2009)
                  mr-mac (16:42 30/4/2009)
                    bhtooefr (16:55 30/4/2009)
                      Acornut (17:41 30/4/2009)
                        mr-mac (18:54 30/4/2009)
                        Acornut (21:04 30/4/2009)
                          mr-mac (10:52 1/5/2009)
                            Monty (11:20 1/5/2009)
                              mr-mac (13:05 1/5/2009)
                                Monty (14:39 1/5/2009)
                                  mr-mac (19:39 1/5/2009)
 
Andrew Duffell Message #109877, posted by ad at 11:59, 25/4/2009
ad

Posts: 3229
£149 seems a lot for a graphics card! I can't see that they are going to sell many.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Steve C Message #109879, posted by Steve at 12:28, 25/4/2009, in reply to message #109877
Member
Posts: 93
£149 seems a lot for a graphics card! I can't see that they are going to sell many.
But it is pretty much the only option - Viewfinders do come up for sale, but not particularly frequently.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Eric Rucker Message #109881, posted by bhtooefr at 23:59, 25/4/2009, in reply to message #109879
Member
Posts: 336
The thing is, it'd cost less to outfit a BeagleBoard with everything needed to make it a full computer (USB hard drive, keyboard, mouse, USB ethernet adapter, and maybe a case) than it would to buy a Viewfinder for a RiscPC.

And then you've got something with as much RAM as a fully-loaded RiscPC, at a MUCH faster speed (both the RAM and the CPU.)

And RO5 is up and running on the BeagleBoard already. (Nowhere near complete, but it is running.)

[Edited by bhtooefr at 01:00, 26/4/2009]
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Paul Stewart Message #109882, posted by sa110_mk at 06:46, 26/4/2009, in reply to message #109877
Member
Posts: 144
£149 seems a lot for a graphics card! I can't see that they are going to sell many.
Judging from the number of punters walking around the show with a shiny new VPod, I do not believe the price is an issue. I know if I still had a RiscPC, i would have been buying myself one of them too.

It just goes to show there sre still so many Risc PC and A7000 users out there, that new podule upgrades are still being produced. It's a sad situation really, that people never got round to upgrading to an Iyonix and still do not upgrade to the newer A9home, but seam to be clinging onto their Risc PC like it is some comfort blanket.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Rob Kendrick Message #109883, posted by nunfetishist at 09:18, 26/4/2009, in reply to message #109877
nunfetishist
Exposing morons since 1981

Posts: 484
£149 seems a lot for a graphics card! I can't see that they are going to sell many.
They're not going to sell many anyway; they've most likely made just enough to sell one to each RiscPC user who has the money to spend, and the economy of scales is not charitable at that point.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Andrew Duffell Message #109884, posted by ad at 09:48, 26/4/2009, in reply to message #109883
ad

Posts: 3229
£149 seems a lot for a graphics card! I can't see that they are going to sell many.
They're not going to sell many anyway; they've most likely made just enough to sell one to each RiscPC user who has the money to spend, and the economy of scales is not charitable at that point.
Really my thought was that even at £149, are they going to sell enough to cover the costs of development and production? How much does this sort of thing cost to produce? Are there really enough Risc PC users still out there who would buy one to cover these costs?!?!
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Simon Challands Message #109885, posted by SimonC at 10:20, 26/4/2009, in reply to message #109884
Elite
Right on, Commander!

Posts: 398
They obviously thought so. There seemed to be plenty of interest at Wakefield (not from me; my RiscPC finally went to the charity stall yesterday).

Hope it works out well, at any rate.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Jeffrey Lee Message #109887, posted by Phlamethrower at 12:19, 26/4/2009, in reply to message #109885
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15057
According to the newsgroups it looks like the max resolution is somewhere around WQXGA (2560x1600). Which is good.

http://groups.google.co.uk/group/comp.sys.acorn.hardware/msg/ea0dc05fc4e3d434
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
van Engelen Thomas Message #109888, posted by highlandcattle at 13:19, 26/4/2009, in reply to message #109885
Member
Posts: 78
*Sniff*

150 is a lot since an A9home cost £593 if then also need an unipod, the choice for an A9 quickly becomes viable. I'm still waiting for the beagle port to become useable
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Paul Stewart Message #109889, posted by sa110_mk at 14:49, 26/4/2009, in reply to message #109888
Member
Posts: 144
Don't foget, that could be a VPod, UniPod and RISC OS 6. May as well go the whole hog and purchase a A9home.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
VinceH Message #109890, posted by VincceH at 16:09, 26/4/2009, in reply to message #109889
VincceH
Lowering the tone since the dawn of time

Posts: 1583
Don't foget, that could be a VPod, UniPod and RISC OS 6. May as well go the whole hog and purchase a A9home.
If you're starting with a RiscPC with none of those expansions, then fair point - but I suspect the majority of people who are likely to buy a Vpod already have a Unipod, or already have RISC OS 6, or both.

I'd suggest that those who don't have any of those three probably won't suddenly decide to buy all three - and not because the combined price makes an A9Home look more appealing; I think they'd be just as unlikely to buy that.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Message #109892, posted by vanpeebles at 07:37, 27/4/2009, in reply to message #109890
Member
Posts: 196
It's the age old Acorn thing really and the reason I got priced out the first time round. When they never made a cheap machine to replace the A3010.

£150 versus nearly £600 is a big difference. Plus lot of people know where they are with an old Risc PC.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Simon Challands Message #109893, posted by SimonC at 10:30, 27/4/2009, in reply to message #109892
Elite
Right on, Commander!

Posts: 398
It's the age old Acorn thing really and the reason I got priced out the first time round. When they never made a cheap machine to replace the A3010.

£150 versus nearly £600 is a big difference. Plus lot of people know where they are with an old Risc PC.
It's the old thing of having to charge more in order to make anything from a much smaller market. A lot of people knew where they were with old BBC Bs too.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Rob Kendrick Message #109894, posted by nunfetishist at 15:52, 27/4/2009, in reply to message #109884
nunfetishist
Exposing morons since 1981

Posts: 484
Really my thought was that even at £149, are they going to sell enough to cover the costs of development and production? How much does this sort of thing cost to produce?
A lot. A long time is spent determining parts, compatibility, memory map, etc before even the schematic or the PCB is designed. Then there is the firmware to develop and test. Then a small prototype run, hand-building them. All that time and engineering has to be paid for before you've even got a product in the market, let alone written the software for it. These costs are the same regardless of if you aim to sell 5 or 5,000. Thus, the smaller the market becomes, the more expensive the hardware gets, because the cost of engineering it (the 'NRE'; non-refundable engineering) has to be spread across fewer and fewer sales. Not to mention that the physical components are cheaper if you buy more of them.

Are there really enough Risc PC users still out there who would buy one to cover these costs?!?!
Given the number of people I spoke to at Wakefield who had bought things in the past for which they have no use for "to support the market", I don't doubt it.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
VinceH Message #109895, posted by VincceH at 17:31, 27/4/2009, in reply to message #109894
VincceH
Lowering the tone since the dawn of time

Posts: 1583
Are there really enough Risc PC users still out there who would buy one to cover these costs?!?!
Given the number of people I spoke to at Wakefield who had bought things in the past for which they have no use for "to support the market", I don't doubt it.
I do wish people wouldn't do that.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
John Message #109896, posted by mr-mac at 19:02, 27/4/2009, in reply to message #109895
Member
Posts: 148
Well I would have bought one at the price.

But having to buy RISC OS 6 as well pushes this out of range for me as my 4.0 roms died so would need to buy 4.0 roms then risc os 6 then the vpod.

Aint going to happen.

Though I would love one as I have a nice samsung LCD that would be great with risc os.

John
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Paul Stewart Message #109911, posted by sa110_mk at 12:21, 28/4/2009, in reply to message #109896
Member
Posts: 144
You could always upgrade to an A9home and enjoy the extra features of RISC OS adjust, and higher resolution graphics!
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
John Message #109912, posted by mr-mac at 12:31, 28/4/2009, in reply to message #109911
Member
Posts: 148
You could always upgrade to an A9home and enjoy the extra features of RISC OS adjust, and higher resolution graphics!
And that costs even more big grin

Not in the market at moment for a £500 computer. Or a £150 device that will cost me £100 in OS upgrades to use.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Eric Rucker Message #109924, posted by bhtooefr at 15:13, 30/4/2009, in reply to message #109912
Member
Posts: 336
Well, to be fair, it's actually £50 in OS upgrades, if you get a one-time, one computer license.

But still, the point remains.

(And, even if it were much cheaper, I wouldn't do it because my RiscPC is in an A7000 case, and therefore only has one podule bay... which is already taken up by a RapIDE32, which is needed because the on-board IDE doesn't get along with the CF card I'm using for the hard drive.)
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
John Message #109927, posted by mr-mac at 16:42, 30/4/2009, in reply to message #109924
Member
Posts: 148
Well, to be fair, it's actually £50 in OS upgrades, if you get a one-time, one computer license.

But still, the point remains.

(And, even if it were much cheaper, I wouldn't do it because my RiscPC is in an A7000 case, and therefore only has one podule bay... which is already taken up by a RapIDE32, which is needed because the on-board IDE doesn't get along with the CF card I'm using for the hard drive.)
Nope £100...

I have risc os 3.7 as my 4.02 roms died so would need to buy 4 IIRC first. Then 6. then the vpod
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Eric Rucker Message #109928, posted by bhtooefr at 16:55, 30/4/2009, in reply to message #109927
Member
Posts: 336
There's 4.02 ROMs on eBay for £25, I believe.

Or I thought I saw 4.39 flash ROMs for even less.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Blind Moose Message #109929, posted by Acornut at 17:41, 30/4/2009, in reply to message #109928
Acornut No-eye-deer (No Idea)

Posts: 487
Or I thought I saw 4.39 flash ROMs for even less
Yup you did, ebay number 110372538289 @ £16.99 + 3.50 PnP smile
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
John Message #109930, posted by mr-mac at 18:54, 30/4/2009, in reply to message #109929
Member
Posts: 148
Flash are no good for me as I have podules...

And would probs go for 4.39 if I was replacing them.

Thanks for links

John
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Blind Moose Message #109932, posted by Acornut at 21:04, 30/4/2009, in reply to message #109929
Acornut No-eye-deer (No Idea)

Posts: 487
Yup you did, ebay number 110372538289 @ £16.99 + 3.50 PnP
This same guy was selling 4.39 OTP ROMS @ £50 + 3.50 pnp that have just finished.

However he does suggest returning the 4.39 flash, ( if for some reason they don't work) plus extra £20 + pnp, for the same 4.39 OTP ROMS.

I could be wrong, but I make that a £9.51 saving?
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
John Message #109935, posted by mr-mac at 10:52, 1/5/2009, in reply to message #109932
Member
Posts: 148
So going back to my orginal statement about £100 in OS upgrades and £150 on hardware. So Vpod just aint going to happen.

And at moment I am not going to shell out another £50 on an OS when I already bought an OS which now isn't working and have other things requiring my money.

I do appreciate the help though.

John

[Edited by mr-mac at 11:53, 1/5/2009]
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Edward Rogers Message #109936, posted by Monty at 11:20, 1/5/2009, in reply to message #109935
Member
Posts: 154
I'm sure this isn't going to be a big enough difference, but;

As RO6 runs ontop of 4.02, surely you'd be fool to buy 4.39 purely to upgrade. I make that £74 sans-postage for the OS.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
John Message #109937, posted by mr-mac at 13:05, 1/5/2009, in reply to message #109936
Member
Posts: 148
Ok so still not a kick in the teeth off of £100 then.

And in all honesty not enough cheaper for me to get vpod.

If all I had to buy was VPOD it would be job done.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Edward Rogers Message #109938, posted by Monty at 14:39, 1/5/2009, in reply to message #109937
Member
Posts: 154
As ROL and A6 seem joined at the hip...

(From ROL's FAQ "What connection does RISC OS 6 have with Advantage 6?

"Lets just say that it is not a co-incidence, indeed we hope that everyone will soon see the advantages of RISC OS 6.")

... perhaps the two companies could offer some bundle deal. VPod and RO6 for £170, something like that. To be honest though, were I in your position thats still too much money for a graphics card with lower colour/res than the Rage 128 on the viewfinder.

I suspect they decided that there was a big enough potencial market already within the existing Select pool. You really aren't their target.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
John Message #109939, posted by mr-mac at 19:39, 1/5/2009, in reply to message #109938
Member
Posts: 148
As ROL and A6 seem joined at the hip...

(From ROL's FAQ "What connection does RISC OS 6 have with Advantage 6?

"Lets just say that it is not a co-incidence, indeed we hope that everyone will soon see the advantages of RISC OS 6.")

... perhaps the two companies could offer some bundle deal. VPod and RO6 for £170, something like that. To be honest though, were I in your position thats still too much money for a graphics card with lower colour/res than the Rage 128 on the viewfinder.

I suspect they decided that there was a big enough potencial market already within the existing Select pool. You really aren't their target.
Shame as I am willing to bet there are loads of Risc OS 3.7 users out there. Who didn't see the benefit of 4.02 or 4.39. But a grfx card good enough for an LCD would be a reason to upgrade. However OS and Card would cost more than the low end desktop x86 machines with OS.

£150-170 inc OS may have just dragged some people with it but £250ish is a bridge to far.

If the RISC OS 5 softload gets ADFS and Networking soon they better work out a way to make it work on other versions quicksmart. I actually think a lot of the people with 3.7 left may even be persuaded to give the RPC a little dust down to give it a go.

Still good to see a hardware product and good to see OS progress on new hardware that has a portable option avilable off the shelf.

John
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Acorn Arcade forums: News and features: VPod Unveiled at Wakefield Show